Pertinax
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Posts posted by Pertinax
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Thats fine , thank you.
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Very , very interesting (and not too far from myself and NN) , this ties into the suggested "lost" route across Morecambe bay towards the Southern lakes.
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Most enjoyable review Ursus. The DVD is falling in price all the time , I saw it in ASDA the other week (blushes in shame) , im sure it will fall further in price and I will hang on till it hits the bargain bins. Shame, I bought series 1 as soon as I could get it. I do have to add though I think that the props and sets are tremendous, the veracity is not disturbed by the inanimate parts of the series (no quips regarding the actors please).
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Have PM from The Augusta saying "meeting is on" so thats good news.
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Thank you MPC, I hope to see some of the original finds in situ or re-created locally. I will certainly photograph any examples I see. I always feel that this "everyday" work makes the past come alive in a very direct way.
I would like to add that , as one might expect, the fashions in furniture tended to radiate out (in time) away from the Italian heartland so that what was fashionable in Rome might appear near 20 years later in Germany say. However some regional fashions do appear to exist , probably it is suggested due to use of local materials and a local craft approach (notably in Britain the use of shale as a material and decorative finish for the legs of tables and "chairs". The Arbeia collection seems to hint at direct import from Rome given the Commanders status.The decrative finish of the rooms is referenced directly to Pompeii , so it is hypothetical for britain (but not wholly unreasonable).
I would also reiterate that we should use the words couch and bed as interchangable descriptions , and assume also that "chair" means "camp stool" (though this might be of a highly ornate or plain nature). The sella curulis is of course an item of status , but it might be best considered as belonging to the "camp stool" idiom , the "masculinity" of its shape and nature do I believe make this a valid sugestion. The literary references to stool and curule make plain the solidarity of citizenship/hierarchy that they represent to soldier and citizen.
This shot exemplifies the decorative context.
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A T Croom has written a very useful piece on furniture in the Roman World. She is curator of the Tyne and Wear Museums (being the eastern extremity of Hadrian's Wall if you are not familiar with the UK). The work ties into the items I posted in the gallery (and related to a blog for "Arbeia") , and I will add a couple more new images to help appreciation. The majority of the evidence for re-construction is from Pompeian and Ercolanian survivals (either actual items or pictorial evidence) , with a lesser body of evidence from Britain and Germany.The work is perhaps a little too specialised for general enjoyment , but to give sensible understanding to quotidian reality it is a useful reference.
http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?autoco...si&img=2154
http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?autoco...si&img=2355
Several general themes are evident, the relative lack of material goods in the roman household (abundance is of course skewed severly towards wealthy households and is also relative to our modern plethora of furnishings and material goods). Secondly the relative absence of clothing storage (as the cost of garments of quality was again highly skewed, only the rich would need storage, ordinary persons might be wearing nearly all they owned), this is not to say items were not stored, but a reliance on semi-portable chests rather than wardrobes is notable. The careful storage of scrolls in wardrobe-like items is noted. The relative absence of chairs with backs as we recognise them (usually if whicker high backed items are available they are for "weaker" persons ie:females and the elderly), the folding stool is the sine qua non of the Roman Citizen/Soldier and no person of rank was ashamed to be so seated .
Children had very few toys of any type, so the modern headache of toy clutter was near totally absent.
Decorative use of quality woods (citron in particular) was the apex of wealth and taste , the key being the display of intricate natural grain (unpainted). The less wealthy would use available woods and if they lacked displayable grain a red colouring seems to have been long fashionable . The poor would use whatever materials were available (woven willow for beds ). There are useful notes on the triclinium as a sumptuary item of conspicuous consumption (more regarding its drapery than intrinsic finish, though that was important).
An informative work, especially for those concerned to re-create an appropriate backdrop for film or book.
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Ive been otherwise engaged myself, but im still ok for the trip.
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Hello everyone, are we still marching North?
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Vorrenus didnt die on screen as has been noted above, McKidd and Stevenson arent a pairing that any commercial producer would really want to break up.Shame alll the heavyweight actors died off due to historical accuracy.
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Ive put a blog entry in regarding furniture at Arbeia (South Shields), the couches may be of interest.
http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?automo...;blogid=19&
I read in Croom:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Roman-Furniture-T-...6466&sr=8-4
that the use of wardrobe and storage space was minimal save for the wealthy (given the relative cost of garments) and that the poor "would adorn their meagre couches with any clothing possible as additional blankets".
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Slightly belated greetings to the Exalted One.
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A business trip has allowed me a quick visit to Arbeia (South Shields) the western end of Hadrian's Wall. Great effort has been expended on re-creating the interior of the Commander's House and the Barrack area as well as the well known re-construction of a defensive gate structure.I have posted some gallery images relating to couces/beds/dining .
http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?automo...si&img=2149
The link leads to the first upload, I will add others here and offsite on MSN.
and the Triclinium of course...
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I suspect that either the chewing of poppy skins (with some residual latex) or the use of henbane herb ,(hyoscine as used today as a pre-med) would be the desired medication (if affordable). The former is accredited for dental work and the latter is more commonplace , but would require skill in dosage versus body mass . Alcohol might be a possibility , certainly id need to be very drunk. My suggestion might be that , as with other procedures, skill and speed were built with practice on the servile so the more fortunate might at least have an uncomfortable, but speedy, excision.
Heres a shot from 2006 from II AVGs visit to the Roman Villa at Gargrave:
http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?automo...si&img=2143
John the Medicus is showing me the delicacy of the eye surgery equipment.
Here is a previous dentistry shot:
http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?automo...=si&img=923
we can see that subtle work could be done.
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Indeed, and the fineness of the equipment (from the "Italian " end of the Empire) puts modern tools to shame. Certainly macular problems and conjunctivitis seem to have been especial problems in Roman Britain (the constant references to eye salve accrediation stamps), I conjecture that a lack of vitamin A , C and D amongst non-native troops in gloomy Britain might have conspired to make this situation worse. A and D can be dealt with via a nice oily fish diet (or decent exposure to sunlight..a precious commodity here).So a dull winter with dull provisions (not unlike mariners suffering the early stages of scurvy) might have made the situation tricky for those from warmer climes.
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Count me in.
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here's another AC! This one is "steady away" with decent beer.
http://www.pubsgalore.co.uk/pubs/30460/
I hope im not making a nuisance of myself.
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For all UNRV bon vivant's this is an excellent place to eat at modest cost:
http://www.herdinghillfarm.co.uk/index.html
not at all far from the Wall.I dont know if this can be edged into the itinerary, but I do reccomend it
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Im ok as well. Doc, the weather should be better at that time of year, but dont count on a heatwave.
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Absolutely Kosmo, the grain was firstly the favoured food of the rat Secondly the rat did not naturally travel , but was "taken along for the ride" in large numbers. Storage of grain was related to processing in urban areas , outbreaks spreading from the dock areas to the city , the wealthiest areas succumbing last. Dissemination within the hinterland followed the main roads, where population was sparse and communications disorganised the bacteria could not penetrate populations so easily, and a flea cannot bite more than a few nomads at any one time. The more i consider the situation the more I am inclined to think that it is the single biggest factor in the military advancement of Islam.
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The plague spread via the main distributive arteries of the rural economy, the main waterborne grain routes providing the fastest transmission of the Y Pestis, metalled highways providing the other route for dissemination.As Rosen observes those intimate to the storage and processing of grain were therefore the most likely to be open to infection, the destruction of ship crewmembers and transport staff would be the first major economic problem for the machinery of empire. The relative density of city supporting populations (say versus arab nomads) also pushes the percentages toward survival downward ie: general popualtin morbidity is enhanced anyway prior to actual mortality.In urban areas the magnitude of mortality was such as to undermine the functioning of city daily life, the dead were so numerous that burying them was beyond the capability of those remaining to attempt the task.Many did of course recover from bubonic infection (that is a relative term of course, perhaps 30 percentum- that would be a dire survivability rate for any other disease) , had the plague transmutted to pneumonic no-one would have survived (thats right 100 percent fatality..scarcely believable , but correct).
The uptake of the three field system was painfully slow, I re-iterate , the suggestion is that a minimun of 200 years were needed to see off the actual "episode" and a further 200 to move toward any properly functioning subinfeudated landscape (so we are getting close to say 966 CE..which date may resonate with the UK members).
Ill have more for you soon Kosmo
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Thank you all very much.
Pantagathus, I only wish circumstances had allowed a vsit to your Nuptial Feast and a detour to the humble seaside tent of the Pater Arcanae. However I hope that (although you do not presently style yourself The Darling of Venus ) you are attending to your Husbandly obligations.
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Nephele: thank you again, and i will be interested to hear what you make of the audio version.
Kosmo:the three field system does not need to be more labour intensive, however the key variable in the context of `"what happens next" after the plague has de-stabilised the existing agricultural status quo , was could some area actually function as a basic agricultural provider to support urban communities?.It wasnt just the destruction of the labour force and the consequent under utilisation of "Southern" soils , rather the three field sytem allowed better nitrogen fixation by enforced rotation/fallow (and the fallow follows a lack of persons to cultivate), on land capable of supporting "easy growing" staples (I mention oats which were treated as a weed ).The "North" achieved a reasonably stable (if probably undermanned) agriculture producing dull staples, whereas the "South" was paralysed by "total systems failure".Rosen is swift to point out that recovery from the plague episodes took perhaps 500 years!
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The compliments and interest engendered are gratefully noted.
Some references that might be useful to Asclepiades regarding likely morbidity/mortality issues:
Hordern (in M Mass ) "Mediterranean Plague in the Age of Justinian (Cambrige Companion to the Age of Justinian) 2004
Biraben and le Goff " Plague in the Early Middle Ages" (in Biology of Man in History..Forster and Ranum) 1975.
Christie Infectious Diseases and Clinical Practice (1969) as quoted in Scott and Duncan Biology of Plagues CUP (2001)
Hollingsworth " Historical demography" cited in Stathakopolous "famine and pestilence in The Late Roman empire and Early Byzantine Empire.(Ashgate 2004)
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A new resource page has appeared at the Ashmolean Museum's website :
Presently of the Antonine period , but looking to be the basis of a much bigger resource.Im sure some of you will find this very exciting , as I do.
Review of "Conversations in Tusculum"
in Colosseum
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"Cato didnt appear in the play as he was dead", that is as good a line as I have read in a long time.Thats a very neat little review (neat in the English sense, not the American vernacular), pithy and amusing. I dont think pig hunting is very far away from the world of Roman aristocratic culture at all.