Teutoberg

[Zama]

Battle: Teutoberg Forest or Teutoberg Wald

Legions destroyed: XVII, XVIII, and XIX

Year of Battle: A.D. 9

Favoured by Augustus, Publius Quinctilius Varus was made consul with Tiberius in 13 B.C. He was also married to a grand-niece of Augustus. Afterwards, Varus was made governor of Syria where, Velleius Paterculus says, a poor Varus quickly became a very wealthy man on the backs of the Syrians. When Augustus, intending to expand his dominion of Germania to the Elbe River, appointed Varus governor to Germania, Varus continued his exploitation of local populations.

 

[edit... full post snipped and reference added per my post below=pp]

[Virgil61]

...

This loss of three legions was one of the worst defeats in Roman history. Velleius Paterculus says it was the worst defeat since Crassus (of the triumvirate with Pompey and Caesar) was killed by the Parthians.

 

Whether Varus was defeated in The Teutoberg Wald or further north is debated.

 

This topic has been covered a dozen times. Was there a new theory or some special insight you'd like to add?

 

EDIT: Zama, as Pertinax added by no means let it put you off in posting on the topic, it's always good to try and add a new insight.

Edited November 5, 2006 by Virgil61

[Pertinax]

Here is one such previous thread:

 

http://www.unrv.com/forum/index.php?showto...varian+disaster

 

Dont be discouraged by this please, but consider that it is useful to search the site for existing /dormant threads that might impinge on a "new thread" . Sometimes these threads can be merged by the Moderators if there is sufficient congruity, repetition of analysis of some well known events/personalities is bound to occur with new members coming "on stream"-so please just check a few keywords before posting!

[Gaius Octavius]

One point not in the thread Pertinax makes reference to, is that Ariminius convinced Varus to take the shorter route through the forest and into the trap, rather than the route through the plain as Varus wanted to.

[Zama]

Point taken, thanks for the advice

[Primus Pilus]

Do not copy and paste other web site pages directly into this forum without giving proper credit.

 

about.com teutoburg

[caldrail]

One point not in the thread Pertinax makes reference to, is that Ariminius convinced Varus to take the shorter route through the forest and into the trap, rather than the route through the plain as Varus wanted to.

 

Of course. Arminius had already arranged the site where the ambush would take place and was intent on making sure Varus blundered right into it. I get the impression that Arminius was a perceptive guy. He realised varus was no great soldier or able leader, so he felt no qualms whatsoever about going to Varus personally and telling him that rebeliion was in progress. It was the truth after all. He just left out the bit about him starting it.

[Gaius Octavius]

Rather than make statements, I will ask questions:

Was Ariminius not an officer in the Roman Army? A citizen of Rome? Was he not a hostage raised by a Roman family?

[Germanicus]

He was certainly an officer, he was also a citizen of Rome and had been give the status of Equestrian. As for hostage, that's perhaps not correct. I don't know that he was raised by a Roman family, and thought that as the younger son of the king of the Cherusci he just had to train and serve in the Roman military as part of the treaty between that tribe, and Rome. I suppose it's equivalent to being a hostage really now that I think about it, I'm sure the Romans could have crucified him had the Cherusci violated terms of the treaty.