Caesar CXXXVII 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2008 Suetonius (The Lives of the Caesars, the Life of Claudius, 32) - "Dicitur etiam meditatus edictum, quo veniam daret flatum crepitumque ventris in convivio emittendi, cum periclitatum qvendam prae pudore ex continentia repperisset." "He is even said to have thought of an edict allowing the privilege of breaking wind quietly or noisily at table, having learned of a man who ran some risk by restraining himself through modesty." But it never was illegal to **** at a dinner party...so why the edict ? Was Suetonius in a good spirit when he wrote this ? Was he joking ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maladict 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2008 Maybe not illegal, but I'm sure people would go to great lengths to avoid it when dining with an emperor. Vespasian probably would have charged you for it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
G-Manicus 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2008 It's illegal in my house, according to Mrs G-Manicus. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Primus Pilus 10 Report post Posted December 24, 2008 Seems to be that Claudius was just making an announcement that such behavior was acceptable and should not be shunned. Perhaps Suetonius was simply taking an opportunity to label Claudius as crass regardless of the truth of such an edict, but I think this fits the emperor's personality. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
caldrail 152 Report post Posted January 9, 2009 A hint about the manners in polite society perhaps? I think Claudius was being nothing more than open-minded and making allowances for unfortunate lapses, and whereas some emperors may well have used it as an excuse to demand strict behaviour, Claudius was more congenial. Regarding Suetonius, its difficult to say whether he was trying to criticise. Suetonius had a 'warts and all' approach and included all sorts of eyebrow-raising anecdotes. Certainly he was writing to please an audience that enjoyed such imperial gossip - the same phenomenon goes on today in the tabloid press - but to me it seems thats all it is, and that Suetonius isn't trying to besmirch their name for any personal grudge or dislike, but rather because it made his history more entertaining, and notice that while he writes this, his tone remains (or tries to remain) impartial. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Augusta 1 Report post Posted January 9, 2009 I'm with Calders on this one. It was obviously considered impolite to break wind in public in ancient Rome, as it is today (thank the gods!) I'm writing this hurriedly, so I don't have the immediate reference to hand, but there is a very vivid poem from Catullus (late Republic) in which a man is decried for having - excuse me, mods - an arse that smelled as bad as his mouth. Thus, bad breath, smelly flatulence, bad hygiene etc. were clearly all fair game for criticism among the better folk in society. I do remember this little anecdote from Suetonius making an appearance in BBC's 'I, Claudius'. Claudius is being examined by his doctor who tells him that if he has wind he should let it out. I quote: 'I don't care which end you let it out, but let it out. He who puts good manners before good health is a fool.' Perhaps this is what prompted Claudius to pass his edict. Even today, doctors will say that you shouldn't 'keep it in' - it's bad for the bowels. A lovely, light-hearted topic for a Friday evening, Caesar - especially as I've had a hard day at work! It's just what I needed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maty 26 Report post Posted January 9, 2009 Smells certainly seemed to matter to the Romans. One writer (Martial?) commented on someone who breathed on on some perfume and turned it to liquamen (a particularly pungent sauce made from decayed fish). With Claudius, I recall reading a comment in Seneca that one of the side effects of whatever Claudius ate that killed him was extreme flatulence. Given that Seneca was not, to put it mildly, a Claudius fan, it is possible he added this comment to further debase the memory of a man he appears to have despised. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gaius Paulinus Maximus 2 Report post Posted January 9, 2009 (edited) I'm with Calders on this one. It was obviously considered impolite to break wind in public in ancient Rome, as it is today (thank the gods!) I'm writing this hurriedly, so I don't have the immediate reference to hand, but there is a very vivid poem from Catullus (late Republic) in which a man is decried for having - excuse me, mods - an arse that smelled as bad as his mouth. Thus, bad breath, smelly flatulence, bad hygiene etc. were clearly all fair game for criticism among the better folk in society. I think this is the poem your referring to......... Disgusting: To Aemillius I did not (may the gods love me) think it mattered whether I might be smelling Aemilius's mouth or arse. The one's no cleaner, the other's no dirtier, in fact his arse is both cleaner and nicer: since it's no teeth. Indeed, the other has foot long teeth, gums like an old box-cart, and jaws that usually gape like the open cunt of a pissing mule on heat. He fucks lots of women, and makes himself out to be charming, and isn't set to the mill with the ass? Shouldn't we think, of any girl touching him, she's capable of licking a foul hangman's arse? You've got to love Catullus haven't you, the man is wonderfully vulgar! Edited January 9, 2009 by Gaius Paulinus Maximus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Caesar CXXXVII 0 Report post Posted January 10, 2009 A lovely, light-hearted topic for a Friday evening, Caesar - especially as I've had a hard day at work! It's just what I needed. My pleasure, Augusta Share this post Link to post Share on other sites