[Britain After The Romans]

Speaking of imports from China, I come across the strangest stuff sometimes, and usually while researching towards something else. Here is a story that I do not attempt to validate. I am only presenting it as found...

 

http://www.bournemouth.ac.uk/caah/landscap...down_man_l.html

 

And so, we take note that there are actually two Chinese vessels noted here in the link info that seem to have been found in Kent from Roman times. One of the objects had its authenticity questioned but not dismissed. But the other apparently was not questioned as to its authenticity. I just thought I would share this with you.

[Britain After The Romans]

Well pottery making didnt completely dry up after the Romans left, but the stuff that the Saxons made was rough, inferior, and few and far between. And we must remember that a great deal of the Roman era pottery was actually made in Roman Gaul. The collapse of the cross channel trade led greatly to the end of high quality pottery in Britain, along with a general collapse of British made quality pottery as well. We might look to the funerary practices of the different cultures to see this.

....

 

I would take issue with part of your point regarding the production (and by implication distribution) of Roman pottery in Britain.

 

While granted that the Gaulish (and other continental) centres of production did have some influence on Britain, as can be seen from the individual pottery distribution maps available at this link to Potsherd website, Roman style 'Fineware' pottery production seems in a few instances to have continued in Britain until around the mid 5th century - long after direct continental imports had ceased.

 

Unfortunately what the maps cannot show is the extent to which pottery production continued although as you implied it probably was a shrinking market as Roman influenced financing and consequently infrastructure supporting it declined.

 

And demographics played a part in it as well. The collapse of Roman Britain also seems to have apparently happened in a time of depopulation. It seems like everything was hitting them all at once...invasions by barbarians, collapse of the monetary systems, plagues, internal strife and political instability, ruralization of the surviving populace, interruptions in the economy and food supply...and on it goes. The more we dig the worse it gets. No wonder the pottery industry took a hit.

And again, the funerary practices had been changing since Christianization, so less need for funerary pieces like burial urns, etc as fewer cremations were taking place.

One thing I have seen here is talk about the semi-fine porcelin mentioned here and there, as being something almost like China. Was it China?

Europe didnt have the good Kaolin clay to make China with, but later Europeans could make severe glaze ceramics. So, is there a school of thought that ceramics of the highest order might have been imported from Asia along the silk road?

[Britain After The Romans]

The conclusion that Britain was less Romanised than other provinces seems pretty convincing. Not only did coinage disappear in the C.5th, but so did pottery - a rather more basic commodity.

 

However, even in Frankia no coinage was minted until about 530. Before then Byzantine and Western Roman coins were possibly in circulation and there's a parallel for that in England:

 

In 1997, a hoard of 22 gold solidi, 25 silver coins or fragments of silver coins, 2 heavy gold rings and 50 small pieces of silver bullion dating to AD 333- c.461-70 was found at Patching, near Worthing, Sussex. The coins included two imperial coins from Ravenna (reign of Valentinian III) dated c. AD440+ and Visigothic coins from the reigns of Majorian (c. 460-1) and Libius Severus (c. 461+). The hoard was buried, possibly in advance of Saxon incursions, around AD475. This is evidence to show that earlier views were not correct and that Roman coins were still reaching Britain well into the 5th century. (Also from www.postroman.info)

 

So it is perhaps possible to overstate the 'differentness' of sub-Roman Britain.

 

As for the Anglo-Saxon kingdoms in the east, these guys really were 'proper' barbarians, not like the Christianised, semi-Romanised Franks and Goths. They had had no direct contact with the Empire and so presumably had no conception of coinage. Therefore it's not surprising that they only start to produce coins from about 600, the date St Augustine arrived in Kent from Rome with the unenviable task of teaching the English how to behave like civilised chaps.

 

Well that's my two sceata's worth,

 

Tom

 

Well pottery making didnt completely dry up after the Romans left, but the stuff that the Saxons made was rough, inferior, and few and far between. And we must remember that a great deal of the Roman era pottery was actually made in Roman Gaul. The collapse of the cross channel trade led greatly to the end of high quality pottery in Britain, along with a general collapse of British made quality pottery as well. We might look to the funerary practices of the different cultures to see this.

Christianity didnt completely go away after the withdrawl of Rome. But the few surviving Christian Churches were led more and more by Irish monks, this being what is commonly called the "Celtic Church". St Augustine did try to bring these independent Churches into the Catholic fold, but without success. The Celtic style Churches were independently organized and small affairs of local significance. And so, St Augustine didnt reintroduce Christianity into Britain in 597 AD, he re-introduced organized Christianity.

It was still a fearful time, and road travel was dangerous. And so, communications were hampered greatly because of the brigands that dotted the landscape. Dark Ages indeed.

[Lost Library in the Kremlin?]

Previously unknown secret passages and rooms were uncovered as recently as 2005 (http://english.pravda.ru/science/19/94/377/15934_Kremlin.html) so who can say? It's certainly a tantalising prospect!

 

I had heard that Tsar Nicholas refused permission for searchers to look for the library as late as the 20th century. So the story is an old one.

[Welcome and Introduce Yourself Here]

As Viggen said, welcome to UNRV History.

 

This site will eventually be a comprehensive site on all aspects of Roman era history (not just Rome, but anything within the time period). This will be a constantly changing and updated information resource and will never be "finished". We welcome community discussion on any topic, corrections or disagreements with posted data and anything that will help to improve the site. Any community member is encouraged to add your own original content and receive full credit for authorship, and help grow this site into a major Roman history destination.

 

Thanks,

primuspilus

 

Hello all. I am Senium, an American novice historian. I think I will like it here.

[Durovernum Cantiacorum (Canterbury)]

Hello all. Im new here and pleased to be in such August company.

 

My querries about Roman Canterbury are two fold. Here goes...

Was there an ancient pilgrimage or otherwise important religious site that the Romanized Celts used in Durovernum Cantiacorum, more than just what would be normal for a Roman-Celtic time. But something really important? Was it a religious center of some sorts up until the late fourth century?

 

And my second question...Did the Christianization of Kent (and Roman Britain in general) lead Durovernum Cantiacorum to begin a decline and depopulation even sooner than th rest of Roman Britain?

 

Your thoughts are greatly appreciated.