Ancient Wonders Posted November 27, 2005 Report Share Posted November 27, 2005 Hi everyone! im new here so sorry if this has been discussed already,just bare with me for a while! anyway,im studing ancient Rome at school(as a senior student) and i was just wondering what is everyones views/thoughts about the the Principate in general.Was it a good or bad form of the administration of Rome? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primus Pilus Posted November 27, 2005 Report Share Posted November 27, 2005 I'm not sure that 'good or bad' is the appropriate comparison. The principate became a necessity based on the state of political affairs of the time. Was it corrupt and ripe for abuse by less than exemplary 'Princes'? Certainly, but the Republican system had proven to have the same extreme faults. The principate, when led by men of more extraordinary capabilities, was adequate for the state of the world at the time. It allowed Rome to dominate the western world for another 4 centuries, while the continuation of the Republican system likely would've continued to devolve into a state of perpetual civil war and inevitable collapse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Favonius Cornelius Posted November 27, 2005 Report Share Posted November 27, 2005 In terms of the principate for such times, the only bad I can think of really in the scheme of things is a failure to be able to reliably decide who will be the new emperor, and to pick a good one when it is time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Posted November 27, 2005 Report Share Posted November 27, 2005 The Principate: * managed to end the worst excesses of corruption in Roman provincial administration from the Republican tax farmers * allowed provincials a greater share in the Roman empire, at least if they were rich or willing to serve in the legions * Bring the military and economic resources of three continents under one strong leader, which inspired the greatest stretch of relative peace and stability in the Western world * encouraged a cosmopolitan atmosphere of trade and cultural exchange, the likes of which wouldn't be seen again in the Western world until the last 150 years of our time * Finally brought all of Italy into a united political and economic infrastructure * Cultivated the refinement of infrastructure in the provinces, and of art and culture in Rome itself * Brought a clear definition of hierarchy and social orders to imperial society As Favonius says, the main weakness was lack of an established method of finding quality people to fill the top spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullafelix Posted November 27, 2005 Report Share Posted November 27, 2005 I agree with all of the above really. The principate was neccessary to fill the void that had been left by the collapse of the Republic. As a Republic lover myself I harbour some resentment towards Augustus on an emotional level but even I have to admit he was the saviour of Rome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted November 29, 2005 Report Share Posted November 29, 2005 The principate: The good: * Return to the consolidation of military power (also enjoyed through most of the Republic) The bad: * Secret police and omnipotent palace guard * Executions and exiles without trial * No deliberative mechanism for accession * Public financing via the privy-purse rather than senatorial planning * Members of the imperial household could commit rape, incest, and murder with impugnity * Massively inflationary monetary policies * Establishment of serfdom The ugly: * Arts and history monopolized by court apologists * Decline of satire and comedy (but see below) * Risible propaganda-architecture * Stagnation in secular moral and political philosophy * Epidemics of mysticism and fanatical devotion to foreign cults So, yes, Augustus brought an end to one civil war and many of the blessings of peace returned to Rome, but he also wiped out much of what made the Pax Romana worthwhile in the first place, and still didn't manage to solve the problem of civil war much beyond his own dynasty. The Republic needed many reforms badly; Augustus initiated many bad reforms and laid the groundwork for the horrors of the Dark Ages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Posted November 30, 2005 Report Share Posted November 30, 2005 I don't think you can blame Augustus for mysticism and foreign cults. He tried his best to stem the tide of Graeco-Oriental savior religions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted November 30, 2005 Report Share Posted November 30, 2005 (edited) The principate: The good:... The bad:... The ugly:... I might quibble with the Arts or mysticism as being under 'the Ugly', but for the most part our opinions converge on this. Edited November 30, 2005 by Virgil61 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted November 30, 2005 Report Share Posted November 30, 2005 I might quibble with the Arts or mysticism as being under 'the Ugly', but for the most part our opinions converge on this. Mirabile dictu! While we're tossing surprises around, I think most of the optimates were short-sighted fools (but still better than Clodius, Catiline, and you-know-who). I don't think you can blame Augustus for mysticism and foreign cults. He tried his best to stem the tide of Graeco-Oriental savior religions. ...while setting himself up to be worshipped as a god and (unbelievably) the savior of the Republic. So, +1 pt to Caesar's heir for discouraging *foreign* irrationality but -2 pts for encouraging *domestic* irrationality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Wonders Posted December 1, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 1, 2005 thanks so much for all your replies,im definatly getting a better insight to this time.Can anyone suggest ways (preferably websties) where i could find quotes from appropriate ancient sources on this matter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sullafelix Posted December 2, 2005 Report Share Posted December 2, 2005 thanks so much for all your replies,im definatly getting a better insight to this time.Can anyone suggest ways (preferably websties) where i could find quotes from appropriate ancient sources on this matter? Sure no problem. Start with the Perseus Tufts Digital Library and then move on to other sites like The Classics Library. If you are not sure what ancient sources to look through, try Suetonius' 12 Caesars (Life of Augustus) Cassius Dio (boring but informative). Suetonius is a good read, often, in my opinion anyway, wrongly despised for his sensationalist approach to things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Wonders Posted December 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 5, 2005 (edited) Thanks for that,i have managed to get my hands on Suetonius...its good! I have another question. I know that that the issue of succession was a major problem during the Principate, but did it show a weakness in it?? Edited December 5, 2005 by Ancient Wonders Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted December 5, 2005 Report Share Posted December 5, 2005 I have another question. I know that that the issue of succession was a major problem during the Principate, but did it show a weakness in it?? I'd say! Normally, the emperor named his own successor (invariably ratified by the hollow men in the Senate). But what if the emperor were killed before naming a successor? Who would be the emperor then? At various times over Roman history, the successor was--a person of abiliity adopted by a good emperor (Hadrian), the idiot son of a good emperor (Caracalla), the victor in a civil war (too many to list), the first person found by the palace guard (Claudius), and the winner of an auction conducted by the palace guard (Didiamus Julianus). In my view, the impotence of the principate to handle the succession undermines completely its reason for being. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Wonders Posted December 9, 2005 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 Sorry im being a pest but i dont have access to the library anymore and i need to add Tacitus' Annals and Suetonius to my bibliography list,i just dont have the information! if anyone knows could you please help me, or if i can find them on the internet that would be great! thanks so much for all your help guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M. Porcius Cato Posted December 9, 2005 Report Share Posted December 9, 2005 perseus.tufts.edu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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