Armys Of The Houses

[marcus brutus]

would diffrent factions have diffrent types of armor for the troops with diffrent colurs and such, such as the house of ceaser would have diffrent armor than the house of pompey....

[Primus Pilus]

No, that's all video game/hollywood bunk. Differences in appearance would be strictly tied to the time period and regional availability of materials.

[Favonius Cornelius]

Perhaps though there would be different colors...maybe shield designs and standards or tunics under armor or even a ribbon tied to an arm. After all, how the heck would they tell friend from foe when a battle got ugly and mixed?

[Primus Pilus]

Banners, flags and shield markings could be different, but coloring wasn't based on the family house of the commanding general. Symbols, such as the Caesarean bull, often represented the person who founded a legion, but my point was simply that there was not an overall uniform scheme based on the general.

[Onasander]

What about the region? African legions would differ undergarment wise in comparison to troops in Pyreenes, just as American troops from Alaska wear noticably different shirts under their BDU Jacket during the winter over troops stationed in Georgia.

[Lacertus]

What about the region? African legions would differ undergarment wise in comparison to troops in Pyreenes, just as American troops from Alaska wear noticably different shirts under their BDU Jacket during the winter over troops stationed in Georgia.

Yes, I think there were differents between African legions and legions from Britain for example. I saw a picture (cannot find it now unfortunately) of Roman legioner in Britain (bas-relief). The legioner was drown in really celtic trousers and fur cape. It is unlikely that similar clothes were needed in Africa. But it was absolute necessity in Britain. I think legions had analogous equipment and colour spectrum as clothers as scutums etc.

[Primus Pilus]

Thats a perfect example of geographic uniform differences. Indeed, in cold weather environments legionaries may have been issued bracae (pants) and thick wool socks as a standard part of the uniform, that wouldn't be necessary in places like Africa. Though, obviously this was merely a practicality and had nothing to do with the 'house' of the recruiting general.

[Favonius Cornelius]

Banners, flags and shield markings could be different, but coloring wasn't based on the family house of the commanding general. Symbols, such as the Caesarean bull, often represented the person who founded a legion, but my point was simply that there was not an overall uniform scheme based on the general.

 

Hm I have a question for you Primus. Can you recall the symbols of the various great Roman leaders? Sulla and Marius? Caesar and Pompey? Antony and Octavian? Etc.

[Primus Pilus]

Caesar's symbol was the bull and Octavian seems to have followed suit only with a couple of legions. There are other symbols attested for some of Caesar's legions, including Legio XIII which inexplicably used a lion, but since not all evidence survives, its very difficult to know for sure. Several legions founded by Pansa and Octavian during the triumvirate period used different symbols (Capricorn, Pegasus, Lion, Eagle, etc.) so it brings up confusion as to the whole 'who, what and when' of legionary symbols..

 

Not many of Antony's symbols survived. Legio III Cyrenaica's symbol is unknown and Legio IIII Scythica used the Capricorn.

 

I believe that the symbols for any of Pompey's legions is completely unknown, but I have never done any research on it. With Marius, and probably Sulla as well, they were using the 'Marian reform' method. Each legion likely used the 'Eagle' and other symbols of Jupiter. Again, its not something I've ever researched in depth so others may have better insight.

[Germanicus]

The Bull was used by Legions raised by Caesar in Spain, "a symbol as popular in Spain then as it is now"(1)

 

Legions often used a symbol popular in their traditional recruiting grounds, and they for the most part also displayed their birthsign on their standards, that is, their Astrological birthsign. If a Legion was enlisted in March, they would have displayed the fish of Picses etc etc.

 

I do not believe that all Caesaren Legions standards included a Bull, a number of Caesarean Legions were raised by Pompey prior to Caesars governership of Spain, and were simply taken over by him. Considering the importance and tradition involved in Legionary standards, they would not have changed with each new commander. IMO

 

As for uniform differences, I agree with Primus Pilus, strictly related to Geography. Possibly during civil wars there would have been a color sash or some other such identifying mark. But then, Legionaries at least in veteran legions fought next to the men they messed with, and used a buddy system. The standard length of service from Marius to Augustus was 16 years, 20 after that. So when actually in battle, considering the way Romans fought, as a unit, I think they would have easily picked friend from foe (if a foe happened to get between sheilds and into their lines). The other thing to think about is that If I was Caesar, I may well have tried some subterfuge during a battle against Pompey, simply by having a couple of cohorts wear his colors. The watchword was the only sure identifier.

 

(1)DANDO-COLLINS, Stephen "Caesars Legion"

[Jimbow]

Possibly during civil wars there would have been a color sash or some other such identifying mark.

 

According to Tacitus, all it took for two legionaries to infiltrate enemy lines and disable their artillery at Cremona in 69 was the swapping of scuta from dead opponents. They just walked straight up to it and did the deed. We don't know their names as they were killed very quickly, but it does illustrate the lack of difference between legions, or perhaps the big differences between individual soldiers in a strange roundabout way, except for scutum emblems.

 

Cheers,

Jim.

[Onasander]

I'm sure units from far flug geographical locations meating would of been able to tell the differance, that's why I brought it up.

 

Also, during the American civil war, not everyone was dressed in Blue and Grey, the uniforms differed greatly among various companies. Mercanaries fighting with romans would have been quite distictive, and if everything was the same, the quality of the uniform would of been a bit more ragged for the romans (I know they wore cloth under that armor, thier ruck sacks sucked, not to mention all that armor, auhhh.