caldrail Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 (edited) Having just discovered a nineteenth century volume at the local library, I thought it might be interesting to pass on some the information regarding saxon place names that survive to this day. I'm sure there are plenty of others still existing but from these you can get little clues as to how the land was developed during the dark age. These are only saxon phrases and viking extensions are not included. Firstly, it must be realised that the Britain the romans conquered was largely forest. The saxons who followed them were often reclaiming land from mother nature. Field- This is derived from Fell, or cleared woodland. A field is therefore a forest clearing for the purposes of agriculture. Mead- This suffix, so beloved of modern developers, actually means open grazing land reclaimed from marsh. Meadow is derived from it. Bury- An intersting one, because this modern spelling actually means two things. The first is derived from burgh, or hilltop fort. An example is Barbury Castle. The other meaning is derived from berie or flat open land. An example is Avebury, mentioned in the domesday book as Avreberie. Don- Hill. Ton- Or tun. The word town is derived from this, but the original meaning is an enclosed cattle pasture. Ham- A suffix derived from heim or 'Home'. It denotes a settled community. Cot/Cote- A word that signifies a poor mans dwelling. Cottage is derivd from it. For example, Draycott is a place where cottagers, or poor folk, are living. Ey- Island. This can refer to an island in a marsh as well as running water. Dauntsey for instance translates as 'Island of the Danes'. Leigh/Ley- meaning 'By The Wood'. Ford- Not suprisingly, a place where a river can be safely crossed. Bourne- A seasonal stream or rivulet, the sort of thing that dries up in summer. Leaze- This suffix denotes open communal pasture surrounding a thicket of trees. This sort of feature is sometimes seen in west england, although the communal ownership has long since become private. Croft- Fenced or hedged land close to a dwelling, presumably for their use. Pen/Penn- A fenced enclosure. Penning- A disused farmyard or enclosure. Ing- Possibly related to previous definition, Ing refers to the home of a powerful family and the other families who look to them for leadership and protection. Comb/Combe- A distorted word. Comb should mean 'ridge' but often denotes a valley. The other spelling, Combe, is suspected to be derived from Co-Hum which means 'connecting two hills'. Edited April 7, 2007 by caldrail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Dalby Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Comb/Combe- A distorted word. Comb should mean 'ridge' but often denotes a valley. The other spelling, Combe, is suspected to be derived from Co-Hum which means 'connecting two hills'. Very interesting collection of materials, Caldrail. I just want to make a quick comment on this last item. Your source comes from the period when the English (including folklorists and etymologists) disliked the Welsh even more than they do now -- see another thread! Hence no mention of the fact that 'combe' occurs most often in places bordering on remaining areas of Celtic speech, and surely is a loanword linked with Welsh cwm 'valley'. This might explain why it "often denotes a valley"! Your source is not alone. The 'Oxford dictionary of English etymology' does not mention this Celtic link at all. Least said, soonest mended. The 'Oxford English dictionary' does mention it, in one of the very long essays that it devotes to apparent Welsh connections in the English vocabulary: as usual, the main trend of the little essay is to minimize the Welsh link and make it look as if the word is more-than-half Germanic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caldrail Posted April 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 In actual fact, the good Reverend Smith way back in eighteen hundred and something reckoned that the 'co-hum' phrase was pidgin latin used by saxons. I'm no expert on ancient languages though and I guess even back then he knew more about it than I will. Interested to hear of the welsh connection though, because the book was about north wiltshire place names and the maps included showed all the victorian era names which have fallen into disuse since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 What about 'borough', 'shire' and 'sex'? (No wiseacres need apply!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladius Hispaniensis Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 Caldrail I'm surprised wold is not there as in Cotswolde. I'm not an expert on this subject but I'm guessing that the word, sounding similar to the German word for forest, viz. wald, probably means the same thing and is probably of Anglo-Saxon origin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Neil Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 What about 'borough', 'shire' and 'sex'? (No wiseacres need apply!) Borough Roughly corresponds to the Burg, Berg, Borg and Bourg used in teutonic countries and parts of France. It means town. I don't know where 'shire' comes from, although I can tell you that the word 'Sherriff' was originally 'Shire - rieve'. Sex is as follows: Wessex - West Saxons. Essex - East Saxons. Middlesex - middle Saxons. Sussex - South Saxons. The 'sex' element used to be spelt 'Saexe'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caldrail Posted April 3, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 Caldrail I'm surprised wold is not there as in Cotswolde. I'm not an expert on this subject but I'm guessing that the word, sounding similar to the German word for forest, viz. wald, probably means the same thing and is probably of Anglo-Saxon origin. What about 'borough', 'shire' and 'sex'? (No wiseacres need apply!) Borough Roughly corresponds to the Burg, Berg, Borg and Bourg used in teutonic countries and parts of France. It means town. I don't know where 'shire' comes from, although I can tell you that the word 'Sherriff' was originally 'Shire - rieve'. Sex is as follows: Wessex - West Saxons. Essex - East Saxons. Middlesex - middle Saxons. Sussex - South Saxons. The 'sex' element used to be spelt 'Saexe'. I like it. Technically then the Cotswolds are a poor mans forest in saxon times. Thats even more interesting given that the roman town of Corinium (now cirencester) was such an important settlement. Be careful of Sheriff because I believe thats a medieval phrase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Dalby Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 What about ... 'sex'? We'll have none of that in Britannia, thank you ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gladius Hispaniensis Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 And what about England itself?. Isn't that from Angle-Land meaning land of the Angles? If it is then I'm guessing the Angles probably were dominant over their Saxon and Jute cousins politically and culturally. Hope I'm not wrong there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 What about ... 'sex'? We'll have none of that in Britannia, thank you ... Yes, I know! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docoflove1974 Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 What about ... 'sex'? We'll have none of that in Britannia, thank you ... Well, there has to be some...do Brits multiply via Immaculate Conception? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Neil Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 (edited) What about ... 'sex'? We'll have none of that in Britannia, thank you ... Well, there has to be some... Not in THIS part of Britannia! Edited April 3, 2007 by Northern Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaius Octavius Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 What about ... 'sex'? We'll have none of that in Britannia, thank you ... Well, there has to be some... Not in THIS part of Britannia! Why do you people do this to me? You know I can't resist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caldrail Posted April 4, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 And what about England itself?. Isn't that from Angle-Land meaning land of the Angles? If it is then I'm guessing the Angles probably were dominant over their Saxon and Jute cousins politically and culturally. Hope I'm not wrong there. If I'm not mistaken England does indeed mean Angle-Land. That doesn't mean they were dominant, perhaps only that they claimed a larger slice of land, or perhaps claimed it first. There is a difference. The saxons themselves had an unsavoury reputation back then. One monk writes that the saxons are 'a race hateful to god'. Certainly they were expanding aggressively but it took time - it wasn't a massive invasion and blitzkrieg by means - more like small landgrabs by communal groups at the expense of the romano-celts. As I remember, it took something like a century before saxons took territory in wiltshire. Also notice that danes were resident in wiltshire too (Dauntsey = Isle of the Danes) at some point well south of the Danelaw border. So we have small groups wandering into the wilderness and claiming land from mother nature or even better any locals who happen to have done it for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pertinax Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 For our American cousins I suggest this useful title regarding land tenure/place names / evolution of landscape. Its a gentle rewarding tome: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Making-English-Lan...8925&sr=1-2 Secondly as regards 'sex in Britain , we usually keep potatoes in them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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