Germanicus
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Posts posted by Germanicus
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That 'she bang' guy made heaps of cash apparently - you know he released it as a single ?
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Was there a precedent for being appointed dictator for life?
No, it was unprecedented.
Call me crazy O Valerius - but when a guy becomes Dictator for life - I'd call the state a Dictatorship. It doesn't really matter if the Dictator still calls it a Republic.
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Have you seen him on the late night "Advanced Hair" commercials ?
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Agreed. It was only after Augustus became uncontested that it truly became the Principate. Before then, it was still the Republic.
It was a Dictatorship before a principate - and I no one thinks the assasins "restored the republic".
The premise of the thread is that when Caesar became dictator for life, the republic was shattered, and it asks - was it Catos stubborn refusal to compromise that let things get to that point.
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Do you think that the US Army will bomb Washington if it's not payed?
I think if the military personell were not paid for two years and denied their retirment pensions after serving their country in conflict - there could be serious repercussions.
It's obvious for me that Marius created a proffesional army and then was the first roman ever to use it to get absolute power. Can you deny this?Thats my point right there, so thanks - Marius was the cause, NOT the army he used.
An army it's a terrible force and if it's not made from people who want to keep the existing form of government it's nothing you can do to stop it from changing it.I do not believe the rank and file of the Roman Army once professionalised wanted to overthrow the government. They wanted the rewards they were promised, and as the state didn't provide - turned to their leaders.
Like I said, sure there's a link - but a link that could have been avoided while still having a professional army.
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So, Cato died 16 years before the establishment of the empire. He was important for one of the civil wars, not for a crisis that started with Marius and ended with the nephew of his nephew, Octavian.
So you believe the Republic exsisted up to Octavians victory at Actium ?
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Linked certainly, but not a cause in itself as such. I wouldn't call it a disaster, quite the opposite as the reforms bought about Roman arms superiority for at least the next 3-400 years.
A disaster for the republic ? That was the armies fault in the same way that it's the guns fault when someone gets shot and without the reforms we have no way of knowing how things would have gone otherwise against the Cimbri and Tuetones. Where would the men have come from after those crushing defeats like Arusio ?
The proffessional Army is only seen as disaster for the Republic because the state neglected to take care of it's soldiers,(mistake when they are without property or wealth) and individual men used this to bring about realisation of their own interests. Proffessional armies exsist in modern states.....and yet no problem......because the state takes care of them.
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Germanicus - I am not questioning infidelity - this thread is about Julia's alleged extreme promiscuity.
Yes I know having read the thread. There seemed to be a side comming in though in relation to husbands being cuckolded, discretion etc, my only point was that there were Roman patrician women who had affairs and were as equally open about it as Caesar. Not a good idea for Julia though I agree, although perhaps she didn't realise the kind of man her father was.
As to her promiscuity - maybe she was, maybe she wasn't. Actual evidence though only suggests a lover or perhaps a few.
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First quote--Tacitus in the Annals says "Nero fastened the guilt...on a class...called Christians...an immense multitude was convicted...Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illunination...Nero offered his gardens for the spectacle".
Second quote--from Pliny the Younger, in his tenth book, written around Ad 112. The letter is very long but says, among other things, that the pagan temples had been nearly deserted and 'sacrificial animals had few buyers". Pliny had two female slaves who were deaconesses in the church tortured to obtain information about Christianity. Only if the Christian denied Christ and "repeated after me an invocation to the gods, and offered adoration ...to your (Trajan's image) were they to be let go"; otherwise, they were killed.. Pliny explained that his purpose in all this was that "multitudes may be reclaimed from error".
Blessings
Thanks, with regard to Pliny - I am familiar with the letter but didn't interpret it as evidence of massive rates of conversion. His description of it in that letter as being a "degenerate sort of cult carried to extravegant lengths" along with his assertion that it could be "checked and directed to better ends" suggested to me that it had not yet become such a problem.
It would be good to know what Tacitus and Pliny meant by "multitude".
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Within thirty years or so after Christ's death "vast multitudes" of them were killed by Nero. By 112 Pliny was complaining that all the pagan temples were deserted because of the number of converts
Could you please post the quotes for these ? I can remember Pliny saying nothing like this ?
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Where is the evidence for all these claims that aristocratic Roman women were promiscuous?
You mentioned Servilia before - wasn't she mistress to Caesar when married to Decimus Junius Silanus (Consul 62 BC) ? We don't know if it was her only affair, but certainly adultery, and certainly known about - but she didn't suffer ill effects did she ? An aristocrat to boot.
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Cool, thanks Anthonius !
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My vote is cast for Sulla the Lucky. I think the Republic had a chance of recuperating after Marius, but with Sulla the worst of the Roman politics was shown and the power of dictator reached it's most powerful and most horrendous stages. Sulla laid the groundwork for the big names of the Ciceronian era to do their worse
You don't think Sullas aims were the recuperation of the republic ? Seems to me all his political reforms had that in mind, the danger came when they were overturned. Another thread perhaps.
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I agree, although I think I have yet to see a "Docu-Drama" that is not somewhat flat, it seems to be in it's nature.
I tend to take what I can get when it comes to visual representations of Roman history.
What did you think of the guy that played Scipio ? I've seeen him in something else, but can't for the life of me remember what it was.
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I think as Primus Pilus said, persecution under Nero is probably exaggerated, and also agree with you phil that there probably weren't a lot of Christians in Rome in 64ad. However the fact that they are mentioned in historical sources as being killed and scapegoated by Nero makes me think that they were, if in lesser numbers. Persecution is probably the wrong word. I think they were targeted not because they were Christians, but because they were a new appearance, not understood and with their zealous need not to deny their faith and to evangelise, were easily identified and preyed upon.
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I noted that Shane Warne is in trouble....again....
It's not him, it's a set up..........maybe........maybe not - LOL
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I don't question what you say, for a moment.
But my understanding is that her views are listened to and she is respected, when she meets politicians. (Not the subject of this thread though - want to continue the discussion elsewhere?)
No, I don't think we need to continue - I agree that she's certainly shown respect by our politicians.
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I am sure she does so, and has considerable influence - especially with Commonwealth governments.
Sorry, I know you hate to have one comment plucked out, but the queen has negligable influence in this commonwealth country (Australia). She is seen by most of the populace under 40 as an carry over from ye olden days, nothing more.
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I think as Furius says it was highly variable up to Augustus. Polybius service length provision would have the unspoken qualifier whether one goes with 6 or 16 years - in war time.
For the sake of it, the examples Gruen gives are as follows:-
-The majority of Sullas forces acquired in Italy 2 years prior to their being disbanded at the Civil wars conclusion.
-Sertorian War Legions of Pompey and Metellus - Retired after a maximun 10 years service in Spain, some were inherited from Lucullus, but most would have only served 6-7 years.
-Troops called up by L.Piso in 58, dismissed three years later.
One item lends itself to the 6 year term - The fact that the Senate ordered disbandment of part of Lucullus forces who claimed that their term had expired, most of which had only been in the east 7 years.
The fact that Augustus instituted a change, instituting 16 years terms, seems to indicate that it had in fact been 6 prior to that, or perhaps an ad hoc business right up to the Principate.
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While we are toning down....the British should enjoy the ashes while they can, it'll be the only time they do this century - LOL
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Do any sources point to Marius setting a length of service for soldiers ?
The reason I ask is that in a book I am reading (The Last Generation of the Roman republic by Erich Gruen), he says:-
Polybius remarks that in the second century infantrymen were expected to serve for a fixed number of years. The precise number, unfortunately, is corrupt in the text: evidently six, but some editors have read sixteen. Whatever the figure may be, the practice may have been different in the Ciceronian period.He then goes on to give many examples where forces in the 80s through to 50s were discharged after periods as small as two years, but not greater than 10.
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Thanks for the time Dr Keaveney.
How core or otherwise do you think the Tribunician reforms under the Sullan constitution were to Sullas overall plan for strengthening the republic ?
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No idea I'm afraid.
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Could it possibly be part of the peice of the Colossus at Rhodes?
I don't think so - the article mentions that the male torso is only 1 metre high, and is from an equestrian statue.
Deadwood
in Hora Postilla Thermae
Posted
I've been watching DVDs of the HBO Deadwood series - I love it - anyone else like it ?