Violentilla
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Posts posted by Violentilla
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Well, whether its Christianity or Paganism, on the religion folder we generally try to keep things objective, historical and academic rather than personal. While some of us are practicing pagans, this is more of an educational site - unlike, for instance, your Nova Roma, which claims to exist specifically to recreate Rome and its "state" religion.
As for myself, I think getting into personal, modern involvements in faith could open a can of worms - especially when devout Monotheists appear to convert us to their way of thinking (it has been known to happen on this site, much to my annoyance). However, I invite the other Legati and the Triumviri to weigh in on this, and if I am overruled by them then I will bow to their collective counsel.
Just to clarify - this was a historical event, and a presentation of a historic ritual. Being in Nova Roma has nothing whatever to do with anyone's personal religion.
Now, I do perform historically accurate rites on my land, in a historically prepared shrine, as a state ritual for NR, as well as to fulfill my personal duties to the gods. I would like very much to know if posting these is going to be an issue. I actually asked about this already, and everyone seemed to be quite keen on the idea, by the way:
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Just a minor bookkeeping note: Since this deals with modern practice rather than history per se, I am sending it to the afterhours forum. Cheers.
I really hate for it to get buried, and we do this sort of thing often - I was excited about having a place to share the festivals that we do. It is a historically based re-enactment of the ritual, other than my reworking of Horace's poem - which could really be considered a translation of a translation. I hope you will reconsider, since it is pertinent to the Religio forum.
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Wow, thank you for posting the selection you did, it led me to want to read more and mark that translation on my wishlist. The translation I have is readable, but this is really lovely!
V.
Pulitzer Prize nominee for poetry, and New York City's own, Charles Martin, recently came out with a new and highly-acclaimed translation of Ovid's Metamorphoses. Here's an except from one of my (obviously) favorite passages: -
Between what I saw here and with the other thread, it still looks like a good gathering of folks. For the next trip, you might want to 'advertise' (fliers, etc.) with the Classics dept...might get more students and faculty involved, if only to watch the festivities.
I had nothing to do with running or planning this, the soldiers were going and contacted us about setting up a booth and doing a rite for the masses. I was actually concerned that we would get bibles thrown at us, but they all seemed to understand that it was a historical thing.
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I've taken a fancy to the one sleeping under the tree.
It appears he was knocked unconscious while foiling an attempt by someone to steal his shoes!
I'm sure that's exactly what happened. They are fine shoes, those. ;-)
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That is so cool! Is this an official 'club', or a group of people/friends who are interested in Roman culture, etc.? Have you involved faculty (I bet they would be very interested in working in some angles)?
The soldiers are in their respective legios, and we (the Religio folks) are in NOVA ROMA (novaroma.org). Though I should be clear that we are friends outside of NR, with a common interest in Roman history and religion. most of NR does not go to regular functions like this, but we enjoy getting out and doing things like this.
The Classics dept at the university had a few people there, but I'm not sure if they had a lot to do with getting this going.
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Excellent pictures Violentilla... thank you.
However, those are some frightening chariots and villas displayed in the background. Burn the barbarians!!!
Indeed, it was a strange field of battle, with foreign, steed-free chariots everywhere. None of them engaged us however, which was all the better for them!
Barbarian burning is a lovely pastime, though I've taken a fancy to the one sleeping under the tree.
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Salve, V, and congratulations.
Are you included in any of those pics?
Salve, A.
I am the one in the blue palla with the book in the ritual picture.
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On Saturday, a.d. II Idus Oct., six citizens of the province Austrorientalis (NOVA ROMA)
attended the Legio V Alaudae Roman Festivus in Clarksville,
Tennessee, at the Austin Peay State University campus. Those
attending were Violentilla Galeria Saltarix, T. Galerius Malleolus,
Mania Galeria Corvina, her daughter, Aula Galeria Renata, and
myself.
Members of the Legio V Alaudae (Knoxville, TN) and Legio VI Ferrata
(Beaufort, SC) were present under the command of centurions, Bob
Wear and Rusty Myers. Total troop strength was about 10-12 milites,
1 standard-bearer, and the 2 centurions. The Soul of the Warrior
and Legio V also set up as vendors.
America Austrorientalis set up a tent displaying aspects from the
Religio Romana and Roman domestic life. The former featured an
altar set before our tent near a bronze cauldron representing a
fountain or well. The latter included samples of common Celtic &
Roman foods--lentils, millet, barley, oats, turnips, onions, garlic,
oatcakes, and two types of bread--along with moretum (garlic, herb,
and cheese pate), samit (Celtic curds with garlic & dill), honey
butter, and garbanzo & sesame spread (hummus). The bread & side
dishes was sampled freely by the participants and spectators much to
their general enjoyment. Many Nova Roma flyers were distributed.
Apart from demonstrations of Roman military & domestic arts and the
munera (gladitorial games), the provincials held a religion ceremony
at 1:30 p.m. to celebrate the Meditrinalia and Fontinalia.
(I'm the one in the blue palla)
Valete Optime!
Violentilla Galeria Saltatrix
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On Saturday, a.d. II Idus Oct., six citizens of the province Austrorientalis (NOVA ROMA)
attended the Legio V Alaudae Roman Festivus in Clarksville,
Tennessee, at the Austin Peay State University campus. Those
attending were Violentilla Galeria Saltarix, T. Galerius Malleolus,
Mania Galeria Corvina, her daughter, Aula Galeria Renata, and
myself.
Members of the Legio V Alaudae (Knoxville, TN) and Legio VI Ferrata
(Beaufort, SC) were present under the command of centurions, Bob
Wear and Rusty Myers. Total troop strength was about 10-12 milites,
1 standard-bearer, and the 2 centurions. The Soul of the Warrior
and Legio V also set up as vendors.
America Austrorientalis set up a tent displaying aspects from the
Religio Romana and Roman domestic life. The former featured an
altar set before our tent near a bronze cauldron representing a
fountain or well. The latter included samples of common Celtic &
Roman foods--lentils, millet, barley, oats, turnips, onions, garlic,
oatcakes, and two types of bread--along with moretum (garlic, herb,
and cheese pate), samit (Celtic curds with garlic & dill), honey
butter, and garbanzo & sesame spread (hummus). The bread & side
dishes was sampled freely by the participants and spectators much to
their general enjoyment. Many Nova Roma flyers were distributed.
Apart from demonstrations of Roman military & domestic arts and the
munera (gladitorial games), the provincials held a religion ceremony
at 1:30 p.m. to celebrate the Meditrinalia and Fontinalia.
(I'm the one in the blue palla)
Valete Optime!
Violentilla Galeria Saltatrix
N. B. I will post some pictures of the soldiers and barbarians elsewhere in the forum.
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I just came across this, and I am indeed quite female!
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I'm not into online gaming enough to offer any helpful suggestions for your computer, Ursus, but I quite like the idea of real-life role-playing, as was done a few years back by some UCLA folks for their game "Imperium" -- a sort of improvisational theater thing.
They each created their characters (consisting of Roman Aristocrats, Visiting Dignitaries, and Slaves) prior to the start of the game, and then role-played from 7pm until midnight.
During the game, "an authentic Roman feast (based on Apicius's The Art of Cooking)" was served. (Do I sense Pertinax salivating out there?)
Now, that's my kind of game! Wouldn't it be neat if a bunch of us could get together and do something like that? I've already got my ivy wreath to wear!
-- Nephele
Wow, I wish we all lived closer. I serve close to period foods at my celebrations, but I've always wanted to have a real feast, complete with couches and dancers, like in I Claudius. Maybe I should plan one and see who I can get to come!
If you're anywhere on the East Coast, U.S.A., you can count me in! I'll bring some friends -- and a bottle of vino!
The Imperium organizer asked participants to kick in some money to help pay for the dinner, so if you might want to consider that. Otherwise, you could make it a "potluck" Roman feast. Which might even be more fun -- with everyone bringing their own, creative culinary contribution to the feast.
-- Nephele
I'm over near Nashville, Tennessee, so probably too far, but I'll look into planning something anyway. :-)
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I'm not into online gaming enough to offer any helpful suggestions for your computer, Ursus, but I quite like the idea of real-life role-playing, as was done a few years back by some UCLA folks for their game "Imperium" -- a sort of improvisational theater thing.
They each created their characters (consisting of Roman Aristocrats, Visiting Dignitaries, and Slaves) prior to the start of the game, and then role-played from 7pm until midnight.
During the game, "an authentic Roman feast (based on Apicius's The Art of Cooking)" was served. (Do I sense Pertinax salivating out there?)
Now, that's my kind of game! Wouldn't it be neat if a bunch of us could get together and do something like that? I've already got my ivy wreath to wear!
-- Nephele
Wow, I wish we all lived closer. I serve close to period foods at my celebrations, but I've always wanted to have a real feast, complete with couches and dancers, like in I Claudius. Maybe I should plan one and see who I can get to come!
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I prefer puzzle games to intensive strategy games (Though I did like Age of Mythology). I have several puzzle type games with Roman, Greek or Egyptian Themes. They are small, under 30 megs for the most part. Write me off forum if you want one or two, at jademermaid AT charter DOT net Don't ask for all of them, I'm not going to do that.
I have:
Roman:
Roman Bowl - Basically, Arena football with gladiators and barbarians.
Cradle of Rome - Three-in a row type puzzle, where you get to earn Roman buildings as you gain levels.
Pixelus - Very good puzzle game of sliding tiles with a Roman theme.
Venice Deluxe - shooter puzzle with Venetian theme. Modern, obviously, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.
Grecian:
Heroes of Hellas - three in a row type puzzler where you earn hero-themed wallpaper.
Secrets of Olympus - three in a row puzzle with dual playing styles.
Rise of Atlantis - three in a row puzzle game, where you travel the ancient world as you gain levels.
Mythic Marbles - Marble game with a Greek theme
Odyssey - Very cool game, where you control ships and try to get them home.
Egyptian:
Luxor - Zuma-type
Luxor: Amun Rising - Sequel
Love Chess - Chess, with Ancient Egyptian figures, that have sex when they capture. Slow game, but fun to show to your friends. Adult!
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As presented in the live links these are the later period accreditations, hence my impatience with the Perseus server for the Cornelius Agrippa commentary which is more "of the period".
Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa was an occult writer in the Middle Ages, is that who you mean? If so, I still find him to be a later source than I look for to base my rituals on, but I would still like to see the reference.
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These all appear to be, and correct me if I'm wrong, planetary influences of the herbs mentioned, which was something assigned far later in history than I am really interested in. When they say an herb is Saturnine, they mean it is under the influence of the planet Saturn, which is named for the god of course, but I'm not sure I would necessarily use it in a Saturnalia celebration. I will think about it though. :-)
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Does anyone know how long the sales usually last?
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Did you make the (very attractive) garland of a particularly auspicious plant? Mandrake and Hellebore spring to mind of course, but "anythingge that dothe stupifye" would be in the frame according to Cornelius Agrippa, all dark coloured fruits are deemed appropriate as well ( so Belladonna would be a potent symbol).
No, we didn't. can you paste the info you've seen? If possible, I will incorporate it next year.
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Oh yea, duh, that makes sense. I think I zeroed in on the wrong part LOL.
Thanks for the info!
No problem!
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I think I understand, now that I've read through the rest of the ritual. Does it have something to do with him being thrown to Earth and being "released" for a time?
I'm starting to see how the "reversal of roles" could fit in too...his children threw him out of heaven, thus, the children are in control, role reversal. Am I right or way off?
Actually, it has to do with the return to the 'Golden Age', when all things were equal and all things were free. It was during this time that Saturn reigned, and so the Saturnalia is about returning to this time for one day (Kronos is the counterpart to the Roman Saturn).
Hesiod:
A golden race of mortal men who lived in the time of Kronos when he was reigning in heaven. And they lived like gods without sorrow of heart, remote and free from toil: miserable age rested not on them . . . The fruitful earth unforced bare them fruit abundantly and without stint. They dwelt in ease and peace upon their lands with many good things. . . .
Ovid in the sixth book of his Metamorphoses:
In the beginning was the Golden Age, when men of their own accord, without threat of punishment, without laws, maintained good faith and did what was right. . . . The earth itself, without compulsion, untouched by the hoe, unfurrowed by any share, produced all things spontaneously. . . . It was a season of everlasting spring.
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Oh interesting!! I guess it never occurred to me to "tie up" the gods...what's the reasoning behind that?
It is one of the things that was done for the festival. There were ropes kept around the feet of the statue of Saturn, they were untied for the festival and retied afterward. Since the Saturnalia was about reversal of roles and a little bit of unruliness, he was kept tied up the rest of the year. :-)
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Violentilla~
I have that exact same Jupiter statue on my altar!!
What is the purpose of the red string you have tied around him?
We use that Jupiter/ Zeus statue as out Saturnus statue for Saturnalia. The red wool is left on him all year and then he is freed for the evening of Saturnalia.
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Wow, this is great!
Here is a link to the celebrations we've done so far:
http://jadedmyrrhmaid.livejournal.com/tag/religio+romana
I can repost these here by festival, or I can make one big thread and just keep posting there--let me know what is best!
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In the third episode of season one of HBO's Rome, 'An Owl in a Thornbush', Vorenus stops at a shrine to Venus and prays that his wife will love him. He cuts his hand and drips blood onto the altar, telling Venus that he offers his own blood.
Did this ever actually happen in Roman times? I thought sacrifices were always birds or animals -- maybe the occasional human -- or honey-cakes or other gifts. I would love to know if any of the primary sources support this dripping of one's own blood on an altar!
Gratias ago!
Flavia
I've not seen anything anywhere regarding an offering of personal blood. I would attribute it to Vorenus, being a drama queen on the edge as usual!
Fontinalia, Clarksville TN (USA)
in Repetere Actionem
Posted · Edited by Violentilla
I didn't know there were blogs, and never have looked at them or noticed them at UNRV. I'd rather just post them in the forum, but if that's where they are supposed to go, I'll consider doing that. I have a livejournal already though, and would probably not keep up with another blog very well.