FLavius Valerius Constantinus Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 Well, as everyone in America has heard that the transit union finally has gone on strike. Now that's really detrimental, the estimates put it at a lost of four hundred million dollars PER DAY. Even the judicial courts has outlawed and considered it illegal to strike. Everyone in New York City that has a car now is required, mandatory, to make a carpool, at least 4 people per car. Some people have walked very long miles to get to work in the freezing cold, I feel especially bad for the young and old. Getting home tonight is gonna be extremely hard for people. So whoever lives in New York, how is it going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Favonius Cornelius Posted December 20, 2005 Report Share Posted December 20, 2005 (edited) As tough as it makes life for New Yorkers, I am willing to bet the transit workers have a good rationale for striking. Here in San Diego there are protests against corporations on just about every corner, and beggars on all the major streets. It NEVER was like this a few years ago when I first moved out here. We live in some lean and mean times these days. I wish I could have started my career in the 90s. Edited December 20, 2005 by Favonius Cornelius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlapse Posted December 22, 2005 Report Share Posted December 22, 2005 I'm sure there are a lot of people who have a hard time putting food on the table who would LOVE to work the jobs that the stikers find unacceptable. My wife works for a government contractor and it is also illegal for them to strike. The people she works with are some of most lazy and jaded people I've ever seen. The people she deals with at work appall me on a daily basis, but hey its about 10 times better than her old job. Just my own personal bias, but really... I've worked some crappy jobs and when I was dissatisfied, I found a different one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted December 22, 2005 Report Share Posted December 22, 2005 I'm sure there are a lot of people who have a hard time putting food on the table who would LOVE to work the jobs that the stikers find unacceptable. My wife works for a government contractor and it is also illegal for them to strike. The people she works with are some of most lazy and jaded people I've ever seen. The people she deals with at work appall me on a daily basis, but hey its about 10 times better than her old job. Just my own personal bias, but really... I've worked some crappy jobs and when I was dissatisfied, I found a different one. I don't think there's anything wrong with striking per se. The Unions behind it helped bring in some great reforms you and I don't have to worry about. And laborers should be allowed to leverage in mass their common needs. It's as much a part of the capitalist process as corporations. What ticks me off about NYC is the fact the strike is illegal and the Union broke the law as well as screwing over hundreds of NYC businesses who depend on this Christmas business to make the year profitable. The government of NYC and the Union would have been made to go to a mutually agreeable arbitrator to settle the issue in lieu of the right to strike. Striking is a fine and legit approach to leveraging against companies if legal and like everything in life timing is everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Posted December 22, 2005 Report Share Posted December 22, 2005 Not living in NYC, I really don't care that much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlapse Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 I don't think there's anything wrong with striking per se. The Unions behind it helped bring in some great reforms you and I don't have to worry about. And laborers should be allowed to leverage in mass their common needs. It's as much a part of the capitalist process as corporations. What ticks me off about NYC is the fact the strike is illegal and the Union broke the law as well as screwing over hundreds of NYC businesses who depend on this Christmas business to make the year profitable. The government of NYC and the Union would have been made to go to a mutually agreeable arbitrator to settle the issue in lieu of the right to strike. Striking is a fine and legit approach to leveraging against companies if legal and like everything in life timing is everything. Yes, the way that it was put into action was the stupid part, and just the thought that all those people followed like sheep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ludovicus Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 Losing pension benefits is on everyone's mind these days in the USA. And maybe elsewhere. We're losing our middle class here, too. At least the NYC transit workers are taking a stand to protect what was gained in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P.Clodius Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 I couldn't get to work for 3 days despite living in the same city I work in. Chaos! I am sympathetic to the strikers desires but I also hear the side of the MTA too. How can corporations afford the rising costs of healthcare and other benefits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primus Pilus Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 How can corporations afford the rising costs of healthcare and other benefits? They can't and they can't compete with fractional overseas wages and nonexistent benefits, hence the problems. Here in Michigan, an enormous union state where the auto industry is king (though the king is dying), GM and Ford in particular are being hammered by the longevity of its former employees (and the fact that most American's don't give a hoot about supporting American companies). The current membership of the UAW just voted down an extension of benefits to retirees in order to preserve their own prime benefits and avoid additional out of pocket costs for health premiums. The anger among the old timers, many of whom formed the union and worked to give the current crop the benefits they have only to feel as if they've been stabbed in the back, is understandably at a peak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Favonius Cornelius Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 (edited) In the 80's, the total sum of income of a common worker to that of the CEO of a company was about 8 to 30 times. Today it is 300 times. I don't suppose the centralization of money has anything to do with the fall of the middle class? Perhaps our real problem is we do not have a Gracchus. Edited December 23, 2005 by Favonius Cornelius Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spurius Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 In the 80's, the total sum of income of a common worker to that of the CEO of a company was about 8 to 30 times. Today it is 300 times. I don't suppose the centralization of money has anything to do with the fall of the middle class? Perhaps our real problem is we do not have a Gracchus. Ted Kennedy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonlapse Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 In the 80's, the total sum of income of a common worker to that of the CEO of a company was about 8 to 30 times. Today it is 300 times. I don't suppose the centralization of money has anything to do with the fall of the middle class? Perhaps our real problem is we do not have a Gracchus. I think most corporations don't look ahead far enough. While I feel that what they do is their own business, it almost seems that they don't realize that practices like outsourcing have immediate benefits, but once so many local jobs are gone who will they be selling services to? I say let it backlash, and perhaps we'll learn... Don't just put a bandaid over it by bloating government control. If people want a middle class, they can help create it. Not enough people are motivated to achieve or make a difference on their own. P.S. - Every person I know who is motivated and uses their head, would be considered at least middle class. Every person I know who is on welfare or government support neglects to plan ahead or take an active role in determining the course of their life. This isn't exclusively true, but in my personal experience it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sextus Roscius Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 I say let it backlash, and perhaps we'll learn... Thats the problem, we need to learn, but I'd rather not, becuase my generation will be hit by it, the people still in high school, and middle school, and elementary school. It will come back and crush us, which I don't have a problem with considering I come from a fairly well-to-do uper-middle class family and have a good education and I'm in line for a good education in Law most likely. But not everyone does and the people who aren't as fortunte are going to have it really tough. As for the NYC transit strikes, I understand where they are coming from, but I'm mad at the unions for doing it at such a horrible time, and for breaking the law. They are going to cause many NYC business men to fall into the same status as the people striking for a while, which is in turn going to hurt the econemy. All said, I think the Union has a very effective point, but they are being very mean and adding to the pressure of everything. Though there is no good time for anything these days, they might have at least chosen the lesser of options, or at least not Christmas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Virgil61 Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 How can corporations afford the rising costs of healthcare and other benefits? They can't and they can't compete with fractional overseas wages and nonexistent benefits, hence the problems. Here in Michigan, an enormous union state where the auto industry is king (though the king is dying), GM and Ford in particular are being hammered by the longevity of its former employees (and the fact that most American's don't give a hoot about supporting American companies). The current membership of the UAW just voted down an extension of benefits to retirees in order to preserve their own prime benefits and avoid additional out of pocket costs for health premiums. The anger among the old timers, many of whom formed the union and worked to give the current crop the benefits they have only to feel as if they've been stabbed in the back, is understandably at a peak. A few months back I spent four weeks escorting a 18 doctor delegation of chief physicians and department heads from Siberia to the U.S. The Russian healthcare system is in terrible shape in spite of some excellent doctors. The purpose of this and other groups was to learn the U.S. style of medicine and insurance (which the Russian think might be the answer to low spending on medicine). It was an eye-opener for me, we met with Fed, State, Insurance and professional organizations. The bottom line I walked away with: 1. The health system is a quasi-government hospital system already; the VA and Medicaid/Medicare (for those over 65) systems are huge and will not go away. 2. Expanding technology has caused a rise in the price of medicine as those who might have died in the last generation are given very expensive treatment to prolong their lives. You'll live an extra ten or twenty or more years now from something you'd have died from a generation or two ago, but the cure is expensive. 3. Something like 30% of all medical costs are because of treatment given in the last two years of a person's life. The bottom line is that immense savings could start with making decisions at the end of a person's life on whether the treatment is worth the cost, emotionally and financially. 4. Medical Malpractice is responsible for a small minutae of health costs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viggen Posted December 23, 2005 Report Share Posted December 23, 2005 ...i am just glad that i live in a country that has (basically) free medical care for everyone... regards viggen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.